[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 486: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 115: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 115: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 115: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 115: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 115: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 115: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 115: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 115: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 115: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4675: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3817)
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4677: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3817)
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4678: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3817)
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4679: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3817)
PocketMatrix • View topic - The End of Faith
This site is no longer active and is available for archival purposes only. Registration and login is disabled.

The End of Faith


Postby James S » Mar 22, 2006 @ 1:12am

To explicitly answer your question, I think that Christianity already teaches universal acceptance and love. Thus it passes your test. I thought the things I said stated that.

Who says I believe anything only because "my religion tells me"? It sounds like you're arguing against someone other than me, or you're not really paying attention to the things I say. I'm not so low brow, lower-middle class urban spiritual-feel-gooder.
And my "heart of hearts"? What is this, Oprah? Where's my free car? I believe that, all else the same (my personality, my intellectual education, my goals), that if I were Muslim then Christianity would be far more appealing to me than the Muslim faith with which I would have been raised. It's simple, because Christianity is more peaceful and more intelligent.
Of course I'm not the kind of guy that needs to feel okay about going out and getting drunk, hitting a joint, and having a girl suck my dick my senior year of highschool. I don't do stupid stuff.

If by "most Christians" you mean, "a miniscule number of the great number of people I've met in my life who are Christians" then sure, we can agree that "most Christians hate homosexuals." But if you actually mean "most Christians" when you say "most Christians" then I'd be curious to know if you live in an Aryan commune in the countryside outside of Boston. That would certainly explain some things.

The Spirit's revelation to Mary was very much reasonable and testable, because she could either be pregnant or not. Either she was going to get pregnant or she wasn't. Revealed knowledge about the world is always verifiable, because it is about a solid and material thing.

The Catholic church tells everyone that they suffer from a disease: sin. What's new?

You mention in and out groups, but there aren't any restrictions. These message boards are more exclusive. Man, I'd hate to think what you'd say to a Zoroaster.

Generalizations are not bad and sometimes helpful, much like the one about liberals I made. But when you say things that are wrong, such as "most christians hate _______," then I simply must correct you.

I don't know where you're getting your stuff on Augustine of Hippo. Have you not read his Confessions? It's entirely introspection. He claimed that there are limits to our ability to reason in regards to the nature of God ... but other than that...

Have you read Augustine and Aquinas for a class? Because I thought I was getting a liberal education at my school. If you're reading them for yourself, I'd suggest not doing that anymore.

Thank You
James S
pm Insider
 
Posts: 17064
Joined: Jan 12, 2002 @ 2:33pm
Location: Lexington, KY


Postby sandmann » Mar 22, 2006 @ 1:57am

The fates lead him who will;
Him who won't, they drag.

Seneca
User avatar
sandmann
pm Insider
 
Posts: 2707
Joined: Dec 7, 2001 @ 10:58pm
Location: Madison, WI


Postby Brig » Mar 22, 2006 @ 6:34am

Truth is a possession.
User avatar
Brig
<font color=purple>Bombastic Brig</font>
 
Posts: 2769
Joined: Oct 26, 2003 @ 10:57am
Location: Washington


Postby James S » Mar 22, 2006 @ 3:06pm

James S
pm Insider
 
Posts: 17064
Joined: Jan 12, 2002 @ 2:33pm
Location: Lexington, KY


Postby refractor » Mar 22, 2006 @ 4:33pm

User avatar
refractor
pm Insider
 
Posts: 2304
Joined: Feb 5, 2002 @ 1:12pm
Location: Luxembourg


Postby sandmann » Mar 23, 2006 @ 1:16am

The fates lead him who will;
Him who won't, they drag.

Seneca
User avatar
sandmann
pm Insider
 
Posts: 2707
Joined: Dec 7, 2001 @ 10:58pm
Location: Madison, WI


Postby Brig » Mar 23, 2006 @ 3:30am

I kind of missed where the immaculate conception thing was argued; I remember it being stated in passing, but that's a lot of long ass posts to weed through.

If Mary lived in a society where pregnant unmarried women were stoned, wouldn't she have a very strong incentive to lie about how she was impregnated? You know what they say, if you're going to lie, lie BIG. I truly have no idea how revelations are either rational or testable.

Refractor: Though the argument has taken a turn toward focusing on Christian hatred, it really comes down to restrictions on the freedoms of homosexuals as a result of a governmental system that still allows tyranny by the majority. Disallowance of gay marriage is the obvious case.

Though religious institutions adapt to their host cultures, they often lag behind them. The Scotland piece wouldn't be news if it weren't unusual or new.
Truth is a possession.
User avatar
Brig
<font color=purple>Bombastic Brig</font>
 
Posts: 2769
Joined: Oct 26, 2003 @ 10:57am
Location: Washington


Postby James S » Mar 23, 2006 @ 4:03am

Yeah, the Catholics have it all tangled. The immaculate (e or im?) conception refers to Mary being born without sin, in order that Jesus could be born without sin. Seems unnecessary. But that dogma was actually a very important aspect of Christianity for Hitler, because it allowed Jesus to not be a Jew and instead to be a member of the Aryan race.

There are stories about Mary being seduced or raped by a Roman soldier. Could have happened. Even if so it doesn't really matter to me. In fact, several times in the NT Jesus is refered to as a bastard child by crowds and people from Galilee where he grew up. So he obviously didn't look like Joseph or anything. But the virgin birth is insignificant to me. Many Christians see Jesus as a form of substitutionary atonement and try to make him the "perfect sacrifice to end all sacrifices," when in my interpretation he initiated a new covenant between the people and God. The phrase "Son of God" is a title that Israelites used for prophets, kings, judges ... people with authority.

And you know, I don't understand why the gays are so upset! Their rights are not being impinged upon any more than mine! They have the same freedoms that I do. I mean, I can't go out and marry a man, either.
James S
pm Insider
 
Posts: 17064
Joined: Jan 12, 2002 @ 2:33pm
Location: Lexington, KY


Postby sandmann » Mar 23, 2006 @ 4:13am

Interesting. So you don't advocate a literal interpretation to the Bible then, right? Of which sect of Christianity are you a member? I was under the impression that Protestants tend to use the Bible as a more literal authority on account of their distaste for Catholicism's central Church.
The fates lead him who will;
Him who won't, they drag.

Seneca
User avatar
sandmann
pm Insider
 
Posts: 2707
Joined: Dec 7, 2001 @ 10:58pm
Location: Madison, WI


Postby James S » Mar 23, 2006 @ 4:36am

I grew up Methodist, and now I claim to be Anglican. I would probably be Catholic if it weren't for the papal institution which in and of itself isn't offensive, except in its own attempt to be a body of governance.

I've read far too many translations of the Bible to take a literal interpretation. We here all know that the word that was translated as "virgin" from Greek actually means a young girl of early child bearing age. That's just one of many, and not even the best. Besides that the Islamic religious text refers to Mary as a Virgin around 30 times, whereas there are only two times in the Christian Bible that refer to her as a "virgin".

And having actually read the Bible, unlike most Christians these days, I know that what they claim are "literal interpretations" are actually not the way the Bible states things.
James S
pm Insider
 
Posts: 17064
Joined: Jan 12, 2002 @ 2:33pm
Location: Lexington, KY


Postby refractor » Mar 23, 2006 @ 7:10am

Immaculate. I have no idea why I spelt it with an e.

Brig: I was more pointing out that the views of the christian population of the rest of the world isn't necessarily the same as in the US. Even though the anglican church oppose it or are at best schismatic over it gay marriage is legal in the UK now anyway.

I guess I'm just always surprised at how different public opinions are between here and the US.
User avatar
refractor
pm Insider
 
Posts: 2304
Joined: Feb 5, 2002 @ 1:12pm
Location: Luxembourg


Postby damian » Mar 23, 2006 @ 7:20pm

damian
pm Insider
 
Posts: 3960
Joined: Sep 3, 2002 @ 7:59pm
Location: Acton, MA (home), NYC (school)


Postby James S » Mar 24, 2006 @ 5:44am

James S
pm Insider
 
Posts: 17064
Joined: Jan 12, 2002 @ 2:33pm
Location: Lexington, KY


Postby Brig » Mar 24, 2006 @ 7:02am

Truth is a possession.
User avatar
Brig
<font color=purple>Bombastic Brig</font>
 
Posts: 2769
Joined: Oct 26, 2003 @ 10:57am
Location: Washington


Postby James S » Mar 24, 2006 @ 4:52pm

James S
pm Insider
 
Posts: 17064
Joined: Jan 12, 2002 @ 2:33pm
Location: Lexington, KY


PreviousNext

Return to Anything Discussion


Sort


Forum Description

Post all off-topic messages here, almost anything goes.

Moderators:

Dan East, sponge, David Horn, Kevin Gelso, RICoder

Forum permissions

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

cron