C++

[Jaybot]

Frustrated just like you are?  Are you still upset that you couldn't make that SNES emulator that you said you would?  And you know that Visual Basic sucks, do you really want more Crossword and puzzle games for the PPC?<br><br>And what college did you go to?  I understood the Math for 3d graphics/engines my sophomore year of highschool.  I think after calculus, I started to lose sight of what math is actually necessary for 3d... College just made me dumber.

[randall]

I was taking Calculus in high school too. I don't know why anything beyond that would be necessary for 3D.<br><br>But Calculus is normally a second year college class. So maybe that is what Carpe meant.

[Jaybot]

There's nothing wrong with spaghetti code as long as it's only going to be used by yourself.

[randall]

Oh man. I've written plenty of "spaghetti code" thinking I was the only one that was going to use it.<br><br>Well, I WAS the only one that used it, and 6-months later I couldn't make heads or tails of the whole thing.<br><br>So it got scrapped.<br><br>Another thing: USE COMMENTS FOR EVEN THE MOST INANE OPERATIONS. They don't cost anything.

[CARPEDIEM]

Wow, for the first time in my life i totally agree with randall!!!, you are 100% right.<br><br>1st) You can do some really kick ass things in visual basic, i started with it when i was 16 and i really loved it, i don't know why you guys hate it so much, its a great piece of software if you are planning on making a standard win32 api.<br>2) what the fuck is up with you JayBot?, i thought things with you were cool. I never even coded a single line of a Snes Emu, i just asked ONCE if someone wanted to team up with me for the task. In contrast with you guys i don't think i can do really asswhooping things by myself and with little knowledge of programming, teamwork is the key in every big project.<br>3) Im not fucking telling you these things just to fucking say something, Everything is based on my experience, Hell, looking at all the options of Visual C++ just made me shit myself only 3 months ago, and i already knew C!.<br>4) Have you ever fucking even seen a 3d engine dude?, How the fuck do you know what math is required for it???. Im not talking about Quake's engine, i never understood jack shit about it, but i've seen other's like jacco's engine that is featured in my gapi benchmark. Dream on you learned all that shit in highschool. I bet you don't even know what a matrix is.<br><br><br>But things are like this with teenagers, you guys just won't listen to advice, I know that because i was a teenager just like you. So go ahead and see for yourself. I wish you the best of luck bud, really!<br><br><br>Last modification: CARPEDIEM - 04/03/01 at 04:06:47

[Jaybot]

Whoah! Dude, Carpediem, Calm down, dude.  Things were cool, I was just kidding around, you know poking fun/joking?  Like the whole overclocking balls thing, dude I backed you on that.. shit it was just a joke. and yeah i've seen some 3d engine code in my time, but shit, i never said i could program one, just enough to be able to understand where some of it's going, and everyone knows what the matrix is, it was a really kick ass movie with keanu reeves with cool special effects or maybe it was that 4x4 list of numbers used to keep track of transformations.. but i could be wrong. And, I'm not a teenager I haven't been one for awhile now, and I kinda miss it and wish I could go back to being invincible.. but I know what you mean Carpe!  Sorry, if I somehow insulted you.

[CARPEDIEM]

Lol JayBot.<br>I know what you mean, I wish i could go back too and scratch my balls all day long and don't do shit!. I don't like studying all day man!<br>Ohh, those were the days.<br><br>

[Warren]

I'll be getting the 2 books (Complete Idiot's Guide and Sam's Teach it Yourself in 10 Minutes as a reference book) on Thursday or Friday. The CD that comes with The Complete Idiot's Guide to C++, does it have Microsoft (or any other brand) Visual C++, that works in Windows? I don't really know anything about C or C++, so I don't know much about brackets, but brackets are the thing I know best. You need one to start a function and one to end it. C++ For Dummies was much worse. On many reviews I've read on it, they say that the first program they teach you to write is missing a major command line. Oh, I've also read that Tricks of the Windows Game Programming Gurus only teaches 2D games, not 3D. I'll learn 3D game programming from experimenting with the Half-Life source code, and other Half-Life and Quake 3 stuff. And I'll get online tutorials. Do you know of any good online 3D game programming tutorials? Thanks.

[Moose or Chuck]

this makes me want to laugh. "I'm gonna read these 2 books and be ready to make Freakin halflife 2" u people have no understanding of how complicated it is.  Even if you learned the basics you'd need to make every single sprite. Then figure oout how to use those. I'm sorry guys but it takes months to learn C++ not 2 'idiots guides to C++' because those books won't teach you shit.  Iff you actually wanna learn you've gotta start making your own stuff read somethin then make a full prograam that exploits every single thing you can do with that ffunction or command.

[Moose or Chuck]

sidenote: half-lifes source is not released, so you can't 'experiment' with it, unless you have a connection we don't know about

[Warren]

First of all Chuck, the source for Half-Life IS avalible (at least the SDK is). And second, I'm not planning on making Half-Life 2 or anything like that (plus, Half-Life 2 is already being made). I want to make "mods" for it. That does not require completely writing the software. I'm not planning on writing the "Quake 4" engine. Chuck, take your laughter somewhere else, and don't be "all high and mighty" about your C++ knowledge and make fun of people instead of helping them. I didn't start this thread to be made fun of. I started it to get information and help. I don't laugh at people when they tell me they're going to make a Counter-Strike map and want to know how to get started in mapping, I help them and tell them what they need, where to get it, and tricks I've learned. Perhaps you should do the same, Chuck.

[Moose or Chuck]

Warren, The Complete Idiot's Guide comes with a C++ code analyzer. I haven't tried it, but I think it just tells you if the compiler will be able to read your code. It doesn't come with a compiler, linker, or builder. <br>And about skipping the Windows Game Programming book because it's 2D? Doom is 2D, technically so is Quake (atleast the output is). But my point is. It tells you all the DirectX commands, Complete game source code, how to design games, everything you need to know. You can't just say "I'll skip it because I want to do something more advanced." You need to learn the beginner stuff first. Trust me, I've tried several times to just skip it, and look where I'm back to, the Idiot's Guide. Trust me, don't skip anything, It will only hurt you in the long run.<br><br>Chuck- no, NM It's not worth me typing.

[randall]

Here are the MAIN things I learned through VB:<br><br>(reusable) Functions<br>Classes<br>API<br><br>Among other things, I just can't seem to remember anything else at this point.<br><br>Those are all implemented in C++, just in a different manner (no BASIC is NOTHING like C++, not even close). They are key components in most every game that I can think of.<br><br>In VB these are much easier to learn, and it's more of a disciplinary exercise than anything else. It teaches you structure and organization.<br><br>Yeah, VB sucks ass. As far as I'm concerned it's only good for quick-fixes, non-cpu intensive operations and frontends. But that was it's main market anyway.<br><br>It may seem the long way to game programming, but what it teaches up-front will be more valuable once you get to C++. Your code will be cleaner and more organized, and thus MAINTAINABLE (can you say "spaghetti code"?)<br><br>I would stick to the advice of Carpe; he isn't the first person I have heard to advise this.<br><br>Although, if you still feel you can jump right into C++, then go for it. Many people can do this and are very successful. But they are not the norm.<br><br>Last modification: randall - 04/03/01 at 12:20:00

[CARPEDIEM]

Good luck boys, You are going to need it.<br>Btw, you must at least be in 2nd year of college to understand the math involved in 3D graphics.<br>Guys, why don't you listen to me and start with visual basic?<br>I swear that you will all just end up frustrated.<br><br>

[shotgunmessiah]

I just finished reading all these posts, and I just have to say...<br><br>My hovercraft is full of eels.<br>